why do some people think that Eric & Dylan were not bullied even though there were statements of friends and classmates who witness the teasing and the shoving?

People’s definitions of bullying shift a lot depending on who you ask and what their personal experiences with it are. Some people minimise their own experiences, but when they talk about their experiences with someone else that person will react with “that’s horrifying!” and it’s this big “wtf” to the person who had the experience because they don’t realise it was that bad. Similarly, sometimes people call a particular experience horrifying that doesn’t sound so bad to an outsider who hasn’t lived it – but to the person who went through the experience, the event was very impactful and maybe even traumatising. We all react to things differently and have built up our own tolerance levels to bullshit. As such, we don’t get to decide what someone else’s trauma is supposed to look like and how that person is supposed to act as a result of their experiences. What may not look so bad to us might be a nightmare to someone else, after all.

There’s this overwhelming sense of “yeah but other people had it worse” or “I was bullied too and I didn’t shoot up a school” that always comes out to play when people talk about the bullying factor of Columbine. We compare our own experiences to theirs or compare other people’s stories to this one, while we should be looking at the collective information about Columbine as a school environment and at the possibility that Eric and Dylan may have been negatively affected by something in that environment instead. We know for a fact that Columbine was good to athletes but not as good to the non-athletes. We know for a fact that there was bullying going on at the school and that teachers may have turned a blind eye to that. We also know that Eric and Dylan complained about things like social status, had compiled hitlists that featured a fair few people from school, and were not among the most popular it-crowd in the school. We can also infer from the evidence that they were both very sensitive young men who may have found it difficult to connect to people and took perceived slights very seriously.

However, let’s not forget that the boys were bullies to other people as well. They gave as good as they got sometimes and could be outright nasty to some people. I’m not saying that’s an excuse for anything or that it makes their own experiences less awful, but it does give off the impression that they’re less “awh poor babies” and more “meh they had it coming” in some people’s minds. I also think that the fact that they became murderers has a lot to do with why people don’t want to acknowledge the bullying: it humanises Eric and Dylan, but also creates an uncomfortable discussion about the effects of bullying that people are mostly not ready to have.

I have always said that bullying was one of the many contributing factors for the massacre. I have seen some of you in the community claim over the years that it was the only factor and that it was their sole reason for doing what they did. That’s not true, just like it’s not true that it wasn’t a factor at all. Bullying is a godawful thing to do to someone or have done to you, but in terms of Columbine there are many more things to take into account that had an impact on the decisions that Eric and Dylan made for others and for themselves.

It sounds stupid, but I have to say it… I define myself as a Columbiner, and when I think about the guys and realise that they are truly dead and that they killed people, I want to cry. I really wish I had a time machine and help them, because all they needed was just someone that listened to their problems and cared.

Doesn’t sound stupid to me. I can’t even tell you how often I’ve wished for a time machine. While I think that it would’ve helped them if they had a non-judgmental listening ear, I don’t think that this was all they needed and that everything would then be fine. Their issues were far more complex than that and it would take more than a caring person to stop them from going through with a massacre. The sentiment matters, though, and is something I think a lot of us share.

I also think that it’s too easy to forget what happened sometimes. They’re so alive in the material we have of them, be it written words or videotape presences, and it’s very weird to keep on realising that they’re dead and gone and took a lot of innocent people with them. That realisation gets me every time.

Do you think the Klebolds and the Harrises should be made to feel guilty for what their sons did. The Scotts and the Bernalls, from what I’ve seen in interviews seem to put most, if not all, of the blame on them?

I believe that there will always be guilt and soul-searching on the part of a perpetrator’s parents regarding the actions of their child and the state of mind their child may have been in at the time. Parents might feel bad that they were not able to stop the events from happening, or they might feel like they missed out on warning signs that could have allowed them to help their child if they had only seen them in time and understood what they were about. There’s always that question from the outside world of “why didn’t you see what was going on inside your own home?”, which is something I think these parents ask themselves in the aftermath of tragedy no matter what. Even if nobody would say anything about it to them, they would still feel a degree of responsibility where their child is concerned.

It’s also the first thing that a victim’s family wants to know and talk about: what was going on in the household of the perpetrator and could the perpetrator have been prevented from doing what they did by the people closest to them? In that sense, the Scotts and Bernalls are doing nothing out of the ordinary. I would want to know this if I were them, too, and I am certain that the answers they received to their questions aren’t always the most satisfying or comprehensible. It’s already a hard thing for us as researchers to realise that the Klebolds missed things such as Dylan’s dramatic weight loss and that the Harrises missed things such as Eric’s entire arsenal being stashed away in their home despite them knowing of his previous bomb-making and other problematic activities. I can’t imagine how it feels to the families of their victims to realise that these parents may have missed out on critical information that could’ve led to the massacre being prevented. In that respect, I cannot judge those families who would put some measure of the blame on the Klebolds and Harrises when it is apparent that there are things that the Klebolds and particularly the Harrises could’ve done to help.

That said, I don’t believe that a blame-game serves anyone well. It’s not constructive to point fingers and shove the blame at anyone but Eric and Dylan. Eric and Dylan were the ones who went into the school with the full intent of killing and injuring as many people as they could. That’s on them and on them alone. However.. the fact that they were able to stick to the plan and actually go through with their decision is something that we can blame on a great many factors, of which their parents and home life are only a small part.

hi so not so long ago I told my boyfriend that I was depressed and I was having suicidal thoughts this happened when I was in high school. He was the only person I really opened it up and I wanted to talk about it more to make him understand why I was having those thoughts but he didn’t want to talk about it all. At first I was offended that he didn’t want to talk about it was I over reacting?

Hi! It doesn’t sound to me like you were overreacting. You kept this mostly to yourself until you shared this with him. It shows a trust in him for you to open up to him like this, which makes it very difficult when he then doesn’t wish to talk about it with you. Perhaps it’s so that he doesn’t know what to say or what to do with the information you shared with him – it’s a scary subject for a lot of people and it can be hard on people to know and come to terms with the fact that their loved one is feeling depressed and/or suicidal. They don’t always want to know those details that you want to share most with them, which is painful for you but perhaps also understandable at the same time.

Maybe it’d be good to check in with him by saying something like “hey, I shared this with you a while ago, which was very hard for me to do, but I wanted to open up to you about it because I trust and love you – and now I kinda feel bad about having done so, because I get the impression that you don’t want to talk about it at all and prefer to ignore it, and I would like to know why that is so?”. You’re not filling anything in for him by saying that or accusing him of having done something bad, because you’re keeping this entirely in your own perspective by using what we call “I”-messages. (I think, I feel, I have the impression that, etc. – they’re the most defusing and calm way of confronting anything.) That way, you might get to know why he doesn’t really feel like talking about it without getting into a straight-up argument about it.

Did they really died virgins?

Yes, absolutely. There’s no question about that.

I was recently watching the footage of the cafeteria where Dylan and Eric were but I noticed that it was cut for 8 minutes? Do you think it was a computer glitch or something else?

Not a computer glitch, but a tape switch. CCTV footage was turned off between 11:14am and 11:22am by a custodian in order to switch the videotapes the footage was recorded on. These missing minutes previously led investigators to believe that they had missed the bomb placements, but we now know better due to this find that showed the boys placing the bombs earlier than assumed. (Funnily enough, JeffCo is of the opinion that this new information doesn’t affect their investigation.)

What Is Dabrowski’s Emotional Overexcitability of Gifted Children?

This might seem like an odd choice to post here, but I assure you there is method to my madness. For a moment, please consider reading this article with Dylan Klebold in mind. I theorised some years ago that Dylan may have been gifted, based off the little information we had at the time, and Sue Klebold’s recent stories have only fortified my belief in the theory. This article talks about one of the biggest hallmarks of gifted children (and links you to the other hallmarks and interesting accurate information about giftedness, too!) and gives a global overview of some of the behaviours you might see in them as a result.

When we take this and re-contextualise this into Dylan’s part of the story, what does this mean for how we see him? What insight can we glean from this information?

What Is Dabrowski’s Emotional Overexcitability of Gifted Children?

Have you seen this new video where this guy reviews and talks about the TCC and completely rips out on Dylan? It is titled “Straight Outta Tumblr: True Crime Community | SecondClancy”

Haven’t seen it! Sounds like just another one of those “omg I just discovered the evil TCC and I must tell everyone about it!”-things to me, haha. It’s the same old stuff.. people love to rip on us or misinterpret our stuff or whatever. It’s not really something I care about. If people don’t like what I blog, that’s too bad. Won’t stop me from blogging. That said, this community isn’t free of cringeworthy things or people trying to be edgy so I kinda do understand some of the things that are often said by our anti-visitors to the tags.

If what eric wrote in that yearbook is true make’s me want to slap eric who the hell is he to that say when needed help way more than whoever michelle is?

Well, it does look like his handwriting and signature.. I have good faith that it’s the real deal.

Let me ask you something real quick: have you never commented to a friend “jeez, that person needs help” or something along those lines if you’re annoyed by someone’s behaviour or by something else they do/say/whatever? Or haven’t you ever just talked shit about somebody else just to vent your own grievances? I know I have, lol. I don’t think it’s something to take seriously – just an expression that’s likely said with a knowing smile or an eyeroll. Slapping Eric seems extreme to me based on that little bit he wrote.

this isn’t an ask, but I just wanted to convey my appreciation for you and your blog. questions are without a doubt asked in different words over and over again, yet you’ll still provide an answer regardless. I’ve learned quite a few things about our boy that I didn’t know. you’re classy as fuck, never talking shit from anyone and always coming back with an answer that lets people know you’re not the one to mess with. you’re the Eric-cycolpedia and I love you 💖💞

I love you too! Thank you for your kind words of appreciation. While it’s true that some asks can be redundant, some of them are very nice to revisit after a few years or add some thoughts onto if I haven’t talked about that particular subject in a while. Glad you were able to learn some new things!

And, hah, I love being called classy as fuck. Thanks for that! 😉

I agree with you, I think that it is a very rhetorical question. “Did you know they would have shot you?!!” No shit Sherlock, did you know that water is wet? Preventing another Columbine is a far bigger concern to me than if they would have shot me or not, and since they’re dead I know they are incapable of that.

Haha yeah it’s the kind of question that makes me roll my eyes and go “seriously? wow”. It’s like these people are trying to deter us from talking about the case by commenting the most obvious thing possible in the hopes that it’ll shock us enough to stop us. As if we don’t know that Eric and Dylan would’ve murdered us on the spot? Come on now, we’re not grade A delusional over here..

I think it’s so cool that people like you and me are talking about prevention of mass shootings rather than just going “oh my god that’s so saddd prayers for all involved *angelface smiley*” and forgetting about it the next day..

How do you respond to peolpe who tell you “but they (Eric and Dylan) would have shot you too” whenever you show an ounce of sympathy and understanding towards the boys?

I would respond to that with “they probably would’ve”. I don’t think I’d be the exception to the rule for them at all – they were largely indiscriminate in who they killed and their misanthropy indicates that nobody was really safe from their destruction. There is a good chance that they would’ve shot me, too..

.. which begs the follow-up question of “so fucking what?”. They’re dead now and can’t hurt me. There are other people like them out there, though, and if we don’t learn from Eric and Dylan then we stand no chance at stopping future mass shootings from taking place. We have to try and understand what’s going on with them. We have to be sympathetic to their stories and lives, because that’s how we get to see all of them and not just the bits and pieces of terror and tragedy.

Yes, Eric and Dylan would’ve shot me too. Why would they have done that? What would’ve motivated them to do that? Was there any way that they could’ve been prevented from doing that? Those are the questions we need to ask ourselves. Those are the questions I’m asking. I don’t care what they would’ve done to me. I care about what can be done to stop it from happening to other people.

Not sure if anyone has asked you this before but what do *you* think when you look at the stars?

Hah, you get full points for originality. 😉

The stars are comforting to me. I know a lot of people find them scary to contemplate too much, because they remind us of how small we are and how insignificant we seem in the grand scale of the universe. It seems so incredible to me that we are alive at all, though, when you realise that all of these stars have planets around them and that none of those planets have lifeforms like ours does. What are the odds that in all this space, we are the only ones we know of who’re alive in this way? There is something so miraculous in that life-having quality we have and looking at the rest of the universe always reminds me of that.

I also think of how the universe makes us immortal, in a way. We are now looking at stars that no longer exist, simply because it takes so long for them to reach our skies and become visible and they have died out in the meantime.
It also means that a part of our little corner of the universe is now
traveling through space and will arrive at far-off destinations long
after we’ve gone.

We’re looking at death in our night sky and still write stories about how beautiful the stars are and compare the light in people’s eyes to starlight – it’s the only kind of death that we are not scared of, but see the beauty of.

Of course, space always reminds me of how much we don’t know yet. There is so much that we have no idea of. So much that we can still learn and discover. People who say they have all the answers have never looked at a black hole and gone “what’s this?”.. people who think that we know all there is to know about the way the world works have never expanded their reality beyond egocentrism/earth-centrism.. The stars are reminders of the fact that we know so very little when we think we know so much. They ground us and bring us back to that concept that we are still very young and have a lot to learn. Discovering the universe’s many secrets is something that honestly has the ability to make me cry – with every new discovery, every new endeavour, I feel like my soul opens up more.

What did you think of Sue’s book? Sorry if you’ve answered this already! In that case you can just link me to that post lol. I’m reading it right now

I liked the book, though I didn’t think it entirely free of issues. I’ve talked about my opinions of it a bit in these posts: one about my favourite parts of the book and one about the portrayal of Eric.

Hope you’ll enjoy your read of it!

Please write us a book on Eric lol

Hah, someday! If I ever stop procrastinating and start writing..

I’m thinking of making a blog of columbine and since your blog is amazing do you have any advice?

Thank you for the compliment!

Best advice I have is this:

• Know your shit. Gather as much knowledge as you can about Columbine. Hunt down information. Learn to combine the evidence into one working story. Question everything you learn.
• Own up to your mistakes. Especially in the beginning, you’ll make rookie mistakes or conclude something that later proves to be inaccurate. Learn from that and grow. Apologise for the mistake if you feel it necessary.
• Form your own opinions. Learn when to change them and how to let them evolve. If you start out with one opinion and still hold the exact same opinion five years down the line, you’re doing it wrong.
• Never pretend you have all the answers. Don’t be scared to say “I don’t know”.
• Be kind to people. Many who’re attracted to Columbine subject-wise are going through some rough shit or have gone through rough shit in the past. For some, this community is all they have as a safe haven. You never know somebody’s story.
• Do no harm, but take no shit. Don’t instigate fights or say hurtful things. React to provocation with as much equanimity as you can muster. Realise that other people’s hate is not a reflection of you, but of themselves. Always speak your mind in honesty and calm, but don’t be afraid to confront a fight when it’s brought to your doorstep. Don’t engage in public drama, but address matters with fellow bloggers in private as much as you can.
• Give people a follow, go say “hi” to them, respond to interesting posts, like/reblog things you want to see more of in this community, and be socially engaged.
• Write your own stuff. Create your own posts. The information may be old news to you, but might be new to someone else. Write your posts coherently, refer to old posts or other sources if necessary, and try to look at it from the perspective of “if I was new to the case, what would I want to know?” followed by “what new insights can this perspective offer?”.

Good luck!

do you know what book to read that’s mainly on Eric and his life?

Uh.. not really. Brooks’s book has some Eric-background that was interesting, because obviously Brooks knew him and had some history with him, but that’s the only one that comes to mind and you probably know that his book is more of a general Columbine story than anything else.

For Eric and his life, the best bet is still old newspaper articles. If you google his name in relation to one of the places he used to live in pre-Littleton, you’ll find some interesting bits and pieces on his childhood. There’s enough in the evidence about Eric’s time in Littleton, too, although it takes a while to sort out and the only thing that made logical sense to me in that process was to place his journal side-by-side with the diversion papers.

Maybe we’ll have a book about Eric someday..

What do you think is the deal with rebsgoddess? I know you like her, but I don’t understand how one can be so into columbine, yet, defend a bully. I really like you alot, your blog is amazing and everything about you is lovely and graceful but I’m just kinda confused. Thank you for all the time and passion you dedicate on this blog💝

Thank you very much for the kind words and the compliments. They’re much appreciated. =)

I don’t want to get in the middle of that shitton of drama that’s been making the rounds here lately in any way, to be honest with you, and so I’ll keep this reply very brief. The last thing I want to do is offend anybody or get dragged into back-and-forth arguments, so the following is probably all I’ll say on the subject in this public setting.

Rebsgoddess and I get along all right and have occasional conversations about Columbine and some other things when we feel like it. We’re on friendly terms at the moment, though we also disagree at times and have had arguments in the past. She will likely be the first to attest that I call her out on her shit in private whenever the situation calls for it and that I don’t tend to budge on my observations/opinions in that regard. She knows exactly how I feel and think about things, just as she knows that I will not get involved beyond offering her my honest opinions and advice. I will not be the one to call her (or anyone else) out in public, as I find that only leads to more issues and doesn’t help anybody.

I don’t condone bullying. I never have, I never will, and I will confront people about it if necessary. I believe that we can achieve more by being kind to people than we ever can being rude to them. The grace with which I’ve run this blog over the years is the same grace I extend to people in private, though it’s not without its sharp edges. It’s natural for me to be a voice of reason more than anything else, which is probably reflected in how I have chosen to confront any type of drama inside of our community. There’s a difference between building up and breaking down. I prefer to do the former. I will not engage in the latter.

How could Eric write pages about the restricted society we live in that has too many laws and restrictions but praise Nazism which is similar, if not worse, than the society that we live in now?

Because he had no clue what the hell he was even talking about and he
knew it. That whole pull toward Nazism came into being because “it
looked good” and because it played into the whole godlike-spiel that
Eric had going for himself. When push came to shove, however, he knew
that it wasn’t a feasible form of government and that human nature isn’t
meant to be suppressed and constrained like that.

Take these
two excerpts, for example. They are from the same journal entry, but
there was another part in the middle of these that distracts a bit from
what Eric was really saying here. When we extract them from the entry
and place them side-by-side, as it were, we get the following:

“I know how people are and why and I cant stand it! I
love the nazis too… by the way, I fucking cant get enough of the
swastika, the SS, and the iron cross. Hitler and his head boys fucked up
a few times and it cost them the war, but I love their beliefs and who
they were, what they did, and what they wanted. I know that form of gov
couldn’t have lasted long once the human equation was brought in, but
damnit it sure looked good.”

“fucking hate the human equation. Nazism would be fucking great if it
werent for individualism and our natural instinct to ask questions.”

Note
how he mentions ‘the human equation’ once in the first excerpt and once
in the second. This is the bridge that marries these two quotes
together, even though they are separated by another paragraph. The human
equation Eric speaks of is defined by our individualism and our natural
instinct to ask questions. Eric knows that these two things don’t mix
well with Nazism and other forms of totalitarian government. He knows
that what Hitler and his cronies wanted isn’t something that can exist
in our human reality. That’s really what he’s telling us here – no
matter if he agrees with them, he knows that the pursuit of this is
meaningless because human nature dictates that we are not meant to be
subjected to that kind of leadership. We don’t thrive under it in the
long run, because the human mind is naturally curious and wants to cut
itself free of constraints.

Eric himself wouldn’t have
thrived under Nazism and it shows in every single moment of his journal
when he speaks about freedom and wanting to step outside of society to
do his own thing. His own human equation would never take well to being
‘a sheep’ following along with the masses. He only really liked Nazism
from the top shelf but not from the bottom where most people were. It’s
different to be under the yoke of fascism than it is to be a fascist
dictator, and Eric liked the idea of lording it all over others but
hated anything being lorded over him.